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On my last flight, engine #2 wouldn't start. I tried
- a GPU start
- a GEN1 assisted start
- a battery start

In each case, when moving the start/stop knob to start, the engine would not turn at all (line crew verified they saw nothing).

Ultimately, I went back to "Every Major Breakdown Requires An Electrical Restart." After restarting the avionics, the engine started without a problem.

I can upload a video (not very exciting) and also the CMC files (didn't see anything obvious). Has anyone seen this behavior before? Thoughts on whether I should send it to the Embraer contact center for evaluation?

Thanks!

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This is unfortunately a known issue.

FOLPHE500-01/08 talks about it, and essentially says that if you don't have an engine running yet when this happens, try to start the other engine. If that works:

"Turn off the battery switch from the opposite side of the engine. For instance, if engine #1 fails to start, turn off battery #2."
Then disconnect GPU, wait two minutes and turn battery back on.

If you can't get either engine running, turn off all power (including unplugging GPU physically), wait 2 minutes, then start again.

I've had this happen a few times, and the de-power has worked each time for me.

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Hi (Username Protected),

Wow, thank you for such a quick, thorough reply! I just pulled up the FOL and read through it. I should be glad that I only had a problem getting one engine to start.

I do feel somewhat relieved that this isn't just me. All part of the learning experience!

Thanks again.

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I had that happen once and turned off all power and disconnected the #2 battery and connected it back and it started right up. Not sure if that is the same issue or not.

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Yes - weak GPU issue. Make sure that not only turn off batteries and GPU, but also have GPU plug physically disconnected. Then start the opposite engine first. Good to go. It’s what 100s do from time to time.

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It all sounds like the asme issue. For what it's worth, I also physically disconnected the GPU, but that did not work. For what it's worth, when I restarted the system and started the engine successfully, I believe I was on GPU and started the troublesome engine first. So my conclusion was that it was really about restarting the avionics more than anything else, though there are quite possibly multiple factors.

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I believe the fix is from resetting the generator control unit in the engine that wouldn’t start.

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Another thing to watch out for is the failure of the #4 bearing in the engine - we had my company's P100 in for annual inspection at KEYE and I was chatting with the mechanics during the pick up of the airplane. He mentioned that there have been three or four instances recently where an engine wouldn't even turn during the start because of the failure of that bearing. Since there is no N2 rotation, no audible noise is heard during an attempted start, and the FADEC won't turn on the fuel. For many of these failures, there was no indication on the previous flight that anything was amiss.

He said that oil consumption of greater than 1 qt/10 hours flying time was considered to be excess consumption and that in egregious cases of bearing failure, evidence of oil leakage will be observed at the tail end of the jet pipe.

He did not mention if this was endemic to both the P100 and the P300 specifically, but certainly something else to consider.

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Interesting, I hadn't heard of the carbon seal failure being spotted on startup attempt, but no reason to think it might not be caught there.

Good thing to be watching for. I'm thinking you could diagnose this by noting Bat 2 voltage during start attempt- if it's a GCU issue there wouldn't be a drop, but if the bearing is seized the SG would still be drawing a load and dropping B2 voltage.

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All are correct. the logic of the system from what i was told is as follows. Left Battery on, and the right side of system goes through bit check. Right battery turned on and the left side of system goes through bit check. If left battery is low in voltage, the right side sees this and will lock out the Right GCU, and same if right battery is low, it will lock out the Left GCU. Also note, that as long as the GPU is physically connected to the airframe, resetting power will not work until the cord is physically removed from the receptacle

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This just happened to us on both engines. A cold reboot of the plane got rid of the problem. Very strange indeed but thanks for all the previous incite and troubleshooting on this!

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